Showing posts with label Endtimers. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Endtimers. Show all posts

Saturday, May 31, 2008

Can We Keep The Preachers Out Of This?

I doubt it seriously. Thanks to You-tube, they are all getting their 15 or more minutes of fame or infamy as it were.

Funny about the end-timers who cannot shut-the-hell-up, because they are making big bucks promising rapture for the good and tribulation for all of the rest of us, whom they hate and want to see suffer as much as possible. What I can't figure out is how they expect to be taken seriously about the end coming soon, when they are stock piling cash faster than Bonnie and Clyde on a good day. Didn't Jesus say that it was easier for a camel to get through the eye of the needle than for a wealthy man to get into the Kingdom of God?


I'll start taking preachers like Hagee seriously when they give all they own to the poor, take up their cross and really follow the one they claim as their leader. As it stands, they don't seem even know him at all.

by Stephen Day


I lost my father a year-and-a-half ago at the ripe old age of 84. Although, as an aside, there’s no age that’s “ripe” enough when it’s your own father, is there?


For a good portion of his life, Dad was an active minister in the United Church of Christ. Eventually he grew weary of church politics, went back to school for his doctorate and became a sociology professor (where he then, of course, had to put up with academic politics, but that’s a different story). During the last 40 plus years of his life, while he remained an ordained minister and would on occasion fill in on a Sunday, he was never again a church pastor.


So I was a bit surprised when, during his final illness, it became obvious to me that while he was certainly proud of his years spent teaching, at the end of the day he considered himself first and foremost a minister of the United Church of Christ.


It was part of his essence.


And I’m pretty sure I know what Dad’s response would have been, were he still here, to the words of Jeremiah Wright and, per the latest dustup, Father Michael Pfleger: he would have dismissed the whole issue as stupid and insisted that what they say at the pulpit is between them and their congregations and denominations.


Simply put: it’s nobody else’s damn business.


And, no, Dad, though liberal, never said anything nearly as controversial as the now famous words of Rev. Wright or the increasingly famous words of Father Pfleger: his was a subtler approach.


He did, however, occasionally say things capable of causing a stir. One time, in the middle 1960s, for example, he offered a very mild comment on the Vietnam War during a sermon, causing our next door neighbor to storm out of the church in protest (they remained on friendly terms afterwards).


But most of the arguably controversial things — and there weren’t that many of them — Dad said from the pulpit were Scriptural in origin. The Christian faith, after all, has some fairly revolutionary beliefs — things right wing Bible-thumpers often try to ignore (although some are now doing better). Things, for example, having to do with the duty the materially comfortable owe to the poor.


There is very little in our current “greed is good” culture, after all, that can easily be squared with the teachings of Jesus Christ, whatever Rolex wearing televangelists may from time to time claim.


So speaking as a PK (preacher’s kid), let me let you in on a little secret. Getting under people’s skin — sometimes even saying “outrageous” things — is part of a minister’s job. Sermons are supposed to get people thinking, shake them up a little. They can be freewheeling, filled with spontaneous expression. On occasion they can even be over the top and offensive. The idea, of course, is to shake us out of our complacency.


Political correctness and preaching have very little in common.


Father Pfleger’s words about Hillary Clinton, to my ear at least, were, in fact, unfortunate and even offensive. But they were made during a religious service as part of a pastor’s attempt to make a point, whether we agree with it or not, about white attitudes of entitlement. It was not a stump speech made as part of a political campaign.


Pfleger himself is politically active, at least in the sense of being a community activist (where he has done many good things), but at the time he made the statements at issue he was preaching as a clergyman. If he went over the line in the small portion of his sermon that’s currently swimming across the Internet, that’s an issue between him and the congregation.


It’s a somewhat different story, of course, when a preacher, such as Rev. John Hagee, intentionally injects his faith into the political process by arguing that his religious visions or traditions should become the template for American political life. Where that’s true, those visions and traditions become fair game. But even then I wonder if we haven’t gone too far in the direction of flyspecking old sermons looking for something to use against a candidate associated with the pastor in question.


This is a road that will lead nowhere but to grief for both religion and public discourse in this nation. It needs to stop now.


Agreed, but it won't!

THE LAST CHANCE DEMOCRACY CAFE


(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes. I.U. has no affiliation whatsoever with the originator of this article nor is I.U endorsed or sponsored by the originator.)


The Nazis, Fascists and Communists were political parties before they became enemies of liberty and mass murderers.

Tuesday, August 14, 2007

End-Timers, Haters and a few who have a little sense


Some evangelicals counter Hagee view

Web Posted: 08/11/2007 10:31 PM CDT
Abe Levy
Express-News


Not long after Christians United for Israel made a lobbying trip to Washington, other Christians were lining up to oppose CUFI's agenda and letting President Bush know it.

CUFI, founded by San Antonio megachurch pastor John Hagee nearly two years ago to promote a stronger U.S.-Israel alliance, is seeking the support of the more than 50 million evangelicals nationwide. It claims to have 50,000-plus members who hail from churches representing about 2 million.

Evangelicals have customarily been seen as siding with Israel in the Middle East crisis.

But at least a slice of that evangelical community has a different point of view, one that takes up the Palestinian cause along with Israel's.

In a July 29 letter sent to Bush, 34 evangelical leaders, including the presidents of major seminaries, megachurches and nonprofit ministries and organizations, said they support statehood for Israelis and Palestinians and believe a two-state solution matches their Christian faith's teachings on compassion and justice.

"I'm tired of being asked, 'Are you a Christian like (Jerry) Falwell or (John) Hagee or (Pat) Robertson who think Palestinians shouldn't have rights?'" said Bob Roberts Jr., pastor of Northwood Church in Dallas and one of the letter signers. "The whole concept of Christian charity and caring for the underdog is based on God's love for the Palestinians. He loves the Jews, but he loves all of us."

While the letter doesn't cite CUFI directly, it was sent the week after CUFI's Washington trip. Some of the letter's authors said they felt compelled to act because of Hagee's statements that Christians must support Israel to be on God's side of world politics and apocalyptic prophecy.

Hagee could not be reached for comment, but CUFI's president, David Brog, said the letter is a sign of CUFI's influence on evangelicals.

"I think they felt they needed to act and speak up to show (CUFI) doesn't represent every last evangelical," Brog said. "We don't represent every last evangelical. We just represent the majority of evangelicals."

CUFI also sent a letter to the president, dated July 26 and penned by Hagee, urging him not to pressure Israel to give up land for peace because it would only lead to another attack by terrorist organizations bent on Israel's destruction. Bush has announced a plan for a two-state solution in the Holy Land that CUFI warns won't likely work under the current conditions.

CUFI, which asserts only Israel has the historic right to that region, says it hasn't technically ruled out a two-state solution but would support it only if conditions were to drastically change where Palestinian and Muslim leaders could be trusted not to use concessions of land for another round of attacks.

Roberts, the Dallas pastor, was one of three evangelical leaders who attended a conference in the small Muslim country of Qatar in the Middle East. The conference, called the U.S.-Islamic World Forum, drew Western and Muslim leaders for dialogue. There, they discovered Muslim leaders widely believe all evangelicals oppose a Palestinian state, which contributed to the crafting of their letter to the president last month.

"It's not that we're saying we're right and they're wrong," said Joel C. Hunter, senior pastor of Northland Church near Orlando, Fla., who signed the letter and also is on the board of the 30 million-member National Association of Evangelicals. "It's that we don't want it to be represented that the evangelicals have only one point of view on this."

Outside of the evangelical community, CUFI's trip to Washington generated some criticism from people drawn to an online video made by left-leaning journalist Max Blumenthal, a self-described liberal Jew who writes for the Nation, a weekly liberal magazine, and has produced several online videos aimed at exposing hypocrisy among conservative groups.

The video criticizes Hagee's contention that his well-publicized end-time views don't factor into his political lobbying. Blumenthal and a reporter from AlterNet, a left-oriented news site, were escorted off the hotel property after a news conference by CUFI leaders a day before they lobbied at the Capitol.

The Michael Moore-like video depicts CUFI members, most notably former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay and interviews with rank-and-file CUFI members, looking forward to the Second Coming of Christ.

Blumenthal said the experience solidified his claim that CUFI seeks to attract evangelicals with end-time prophetic messages but then denies those beliefs publicly and during political lobbying trips. He sees this as troubling, particularly to Jews, who, according to this theology, are foretold to gather in Israel as the end nears where most are killed during an epic battle between the forces of good and evil. Those remaining are said to convert to Christianity.

"There's an obvious disparity between Hagee and his lieutenants and his grass-roots members," he said. "It's embarrassing for Hagee because his professed support for Israel is really an insidious attempt to fatten up the Jews like a Thanksgiving turkey before sticking them in the oven."

Such statements misconstrue CUFI's mission, Brog said, adding that Blumenthal came with an agenda to create a conspiracy and not to craft a balanced piece.

He said if CUFI members wanted to see the end times come about, they wouldn't work to protect Israel but instead would want the country to be under attack to hasten this prophetic scenario. Brog also noted that Blumenthal did not include footage of more competent CUFI members and didn't follow the rules announced to him by CUFI's public relations team that he get approval from them before conducting interviews.

While members may have "beliefs" in biblical prophecy, their motives are separate and stem from concern about the threat of radical Islamic groups and the recurring theme in the Bible to honor the Jewish people.

"Christian Zionism is based on the promises of Genesis and not the prophecies of Revelation," Brog said. "(Blumenthal) showed two or three people who I think are off-base, and you're going to find that in any group of people. He knew from Day One where he was going, and it was not a search for the truth."


alevy@express-news.net


(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes. I.U. has no affiliation whatsoever with the originator of this article nor is I.U endorsed or sponsored by the originator.)

The Nazis, Fascists and Communists were political parties before they became enemies of liberty and mass murderers.